I AM HealingStrong
Discover how to transform the most challenging chapter of your life with Jim Mann's inspiring podcast. As a stage 4 cancer survivor, Jim interviews famous musical artists like Tasha Layton, Ellie Holcomb, Katy Nichole, and Tim Timmons, as well as health influencers who beat incurable diseases like depression and addiction. Through humor and a renewed sense of purpose, guests courageously share their stories of overcoming the toughest times and learning to trust God. Tune in to Jim's powerful podcast to find hope and inspiration.
I AM HealingStrong
83: Stage 2 Hodgkins Lymphoma: A Mother's Journey to Emotional Resilience & Holistic Health | PART 2
Cortney Campbell's return to our podcast isn't just another episode; it's a deep and moving continuation of her story, one that resonates with anyone who's felt the weight of anxiety and depression. As she opens up about the unforeseen resurgence of mental health struggles after welcoming her third child, Cortney discusses the complex dance between life's joys and challenges, and how generational experiences shape our interactions with our children and ourselves.
When the walls close in and the air feels too heavy to breathe, where do you turn? Cortney shares lifelines—faith, and practical tools that offer solace in the storm of parenting and personal turmoil. This episode shares an honest look into the rawness of motherhood intertwined with the pursuit of emotional well-being.
Ending on a note of hope, Courtney dives into capturing your thoughts and turning them into positive thought patterns, especially when life throws its harshest curves, like a cancer diagnosis. We discuss the transformative potential of diet, exercise, cognitive therapy, and connect these personal strategies to the broader narrative of overcoming and thriving. Whether it's about embracing the present moment or reaching out to communities like HealingStrong for free group support, this episode is an invitation to join us on a journey of healing, empowerment, and rediscovering the resilience that lies within the body God so miraculously designed.
Connect with Cortney Campbell, the "anticancermom" on:
Cortney's blog
Facebook
Instagram
HealingStrong's mission is to educate, equip and empower our group leaders and group participants through their journey with cancer or other chronic illnesses, and know there is HOPE. We bring this hope through educational materials, webinars, guest speakers, conferences, community small group support and more.
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That was really. My first experience with anxiety and depression was in my early 20s. When I went through it again. I was just so shocked that I it was in my early 30s, right after my third daughter was born I just never thought after I had recovered that first time that I would ever go through anxiety and depression again, because I really like learned to master it. And so it was. So it creeped up so sneakily when I was in my 30s because I thought I had a handle on life. And then things just kind of piled in one by one and it was literally my. One of my counselors said it's kind of like a pot of boiling water, like you don't know you're at that boiling point until you're at the boiling point and I just didn't know how to get out of it later in life.
Speaker 3:You're listening to the I Am Healing Strong podcast, a part of the Healing Strong organization, the number one network of holistic cancer support groups in the world. Each week we bring you stories of hope, real stories that will encourage you as you navigate your way on your own journey to health. Now here's your host stage four cancer thriver, jim Mann.
Speaker 2:Today we have Courtney Campbell back with us for part two. She's going to continue her conversation on emotional healing and what she did to be the perfect woman she is now.
Speaker 1:Oh close, as close as you can get here on earth, I guess I'm pretty good.
Speaker 2:Well, that's good, that's good. So last time we talked about part of your journey, right?
Speaker 1:Yeah, so in the last episode of Healing Strong Podcast, I spoke about my journey in my life through being a I would say a very sensitive person with emotional sensitivity and therefore vulnerable to anxiety, depression, stress disorder, whatever you want to call it and really how I overcame that in two different seasons of life. One in my early 20s, when I was experiencing the stressors of like, do I want to marry this guy? Do I want to move to Atlanta or a new city, a big city, you know? Do I want to follow Jesus, who for me was a very foreign concept and very anxiety producing? And then, of course, in the later season of my life, where I went through emotional stress and anxiety, depression and overwhelm was in my, I guess, early to mid 30s, when I had my third baby and I just couldn't handle life coming at me and I really went under emotionally and mentally.
Speaker 1:And I just want to talk about how that is not something to be ashamed of and it's normal, about how that is not something to be ashamed of and it's normal, you know, if you're under amount of stress that you just can't handle and it's just too much for you, whether it's good stress or bad stress, sometimes there can be times in your life where you're experiencing very good stress and it's overwhelming, and that there are ways to cope with it and to new ways to think. So that's what I want to talk about it. It's pretty loaded.
Speaker 2:Well, you forgot. The most important part about last time is we pointed out that I'm just emotionally well-balanced, right? That's the important part Right.
Speaker 1:Like you, jim, are so well-balanced. You didn't struggle with this stuff we talked about in the last interview. Jim's like it's interesting for him to hear me talk about this, because you really haven't. You really haven't. You're kind of even keeled.
Speaker 2:Yeah, either that or I'm just really shallow. I'm not sure.
Speaker 1:Well, you know, one thing that I did not talk about and I'm going to mention it this time is I am the daughter of two. Extremely my father is a lot like you, I'd say, very stable like, kind of even keeled guy, calm like, and my mom, who is feisty, very feisty kind of if she heard this, I don't know if she'd agree with me, but she's just kind of for me, I was born this like kind of sensitive, romantic go-getter, like the world is my oyster. What is that? Is that a saying, yeah, you know, the world's my playground and now I'm all caught up. Did I say that? Right, I sound so stupid. Those are my. I struggle with those thoughts too.
Speaker 1:Anyway, my mom is very, was very like, I guess, kind of emotionally difficult to connect with growing up, and I was extremely emotionally needy and so I often felt like I was just a lot for her and she kind of just didn't know what to do with me. And you know, so I'm. I guess I'm going into this that you know, we, we are not always just who we are. It's sometimes it's the dynamic between parents and children as well, for how you, you know, end up feeling. There's a lot of talk today nowadays about like trauma. You hear a lot of millennials talk about trauma because they, you know are on social media and I don't consider myself a true millennial.
Speaker 1:I'm kind of an old millennial. I was born in 82. So I have that experience of not being a social media like. It's not my native language, but I plugged into the to that world pretty well. I think it older. You know, I got a smartphone when I was 30. But anyway, I'm off topic but.
Speaker 1:But I think, with the whole trauma thing, it's that we're a generation that's expressing that our parents did their best jobs but that they perhaps, like there's more. You know, you can do a little like children. Now our generation is going, we want maybe a little more for our kids as far as, like, connection with us. And I could go off on and on about why I think that is. But I think the parents, like our generation wants to connect with our parents, um, and some of us, like our parents aren't, maybe didn't get that from their parents, like that world war ii greatest generation, and so they can't connect. And then we're trying to connect with them and they're just like what is this? We didn't do this with our parents, um, and it's not to say all uh, parent, child, stuff like that.
Speaker 1:But I think, um, you know maybe some of what I experienced as I got into therapy and we'll talk more about the anxiety and depression stuff. But um was a little bit of. I always think I have to do and do and do because I have to prove myself. I want this like approval right, so anyone who's into psychology could know where I'm going with that. But there was some of that going on for me for sure. I think one of the reasons I got to the point of overwhelming stress in both seasons I went through an anxiety depression season in my life is because I was just like especially the one in my 30s I was like I had to, I had to do things in order to feel significant and I overwhelmed myself.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's summary when you were explaining all that, I had all kinds of names to plug into those personality types. And I have four kids and it's true they all react to us differently. Some are just like so dramatic, you know, like what in the world did, I say? And another one who I just had lunch with, I always call her my perfect child. That's because she's also very compliant.
Speaker 1:She's easy, she's easier on you.
Speaker 2:Yeah. She doesn't have issue with you no, no, no, and and there's no big. You know there's no big drama, but it's just how they react. Uh, I was plugging in all kinds of names here, but yeah, tell us now how you kind of work through that. You know what. What did you do to kind of get some balance in your life, to be more like me, of course?
Speaker 1:Yeah. So my biggest problem with my emotional health was anxiety and I don't remember being a super anxious kid. I actually am a pretty chill person. But when I first started feeling anxiety in my early 20s was when I was in particular. I had met this boy and I really liked him and he lived in Atlanta and I lived down in West Palm Beach, florida, and we knew each other in college. We actually saw each other at homecoming that year and like literal sparks flew between us. I don't know if I've shared this story, but we, like sparks flew between us. I, I don't know if I've shared this story, but we, we like sparks flew between our hearts. Like I saw him at this place, we used to go and zing like straight across the room, right, um, and we later talked about did you feel that? Yeah, did you feel that? Yeah? And we went back to um, our, where we lived, and we talked on the phone for a few weeks and finally he decided. He decided he was going to come visit and so he flew down to West Palm Beach to visit me. I was planning on staying like five or six days and I was just, we were on cloud nine. I was so in love.
Speaker 1:And but like by the second, by the time he was getting there, he like flew down there. I was so nervous that I literally threw myself into my. I had not experienced ever but a panic attack, and I had it with him there and I was like trying to hide, basically like I felt so anxious, I just wanted him to leave and and it kind of like flew into this. Um, I had no idea what was going on and so, for anyone who's listening, if you've ever had a panic attack, you probably know what I mean. It's strange. I don't know if I would be able to explain how it feels. It's just this ultimate panicky. I've got to get out of my body, I've got to run feeling, and so I just wanted him to leave. Basically, I was just so revved up and my heart, like my heart was beating, I was shaking, I couldn't eat anything. And here he was. His plane ticket wasn't booked for, you know, to go back home for like four, three or four days, and I had to just like pretend I was fine.
Speaker 1:But I was dealing with this really weird thing I'd never had before in my life. So I mentioned in the last episode I had had that feeling before and I told you how it was when I was five years old and I was spending a night at a friend's house and I felt trapped and couldn't get out, and I just didn't know. So I experienced it as a young child, but not since then. And here I was like 23, I think, or something like that, so like 2000, 2000, whatever, six, five, something like that. And so anyway, I got through that, that trip, but I just I don't know how he didn't know I was, something was wrong with me. I was just trying to fake my way.
Speaker 1:And once he left I was like good, okay, can't ever see him again. But I was so confused because I was so crazy about him, and so anyway, I went through this for the next couple months, like trying to wrestle, like he kind of wanted to continue with the relationship, um, and chatting. You know he actually wanted to make it like official and I was just like I was dealing with what was I know now is generalized anxiety disorder, where I had this panic attack. I was freaking out like what, if that happens again, what can I do? I started, um, kind of becoming more agoraphobic, which is when you like don't want to leave your house because you're afraid of this panic attack happening again.
Speaker 2:Wow.
Speaker 1:So what happened was I wrestled with this for about eight or nine months and, long story short, during that time he started talking to me about faith and about God and, honestly, I wanted so badly to feel better that I was willing to listen to anything. And God worked in my life in different little breadcrumbs. We didn't start calling him that then we actually, years later, I started calling him that after the cancer story, because God dropped those little breadcrumbs to follow and to help you and for me. One of the first things that the boyfriend said to me was you need God. There's a place in your heart that you can't fill with all these worldly things, with dating or alcohol, partying, fitness, whatever it was I was doing at the time to make me feel special. And he said there's this book that I um, I was actually flying on the plane when I came to see you and the. I sat next to a pastor and I told him about this. My husband, my husband, Okay, I give it away.
Speaker 1:He's my husband now. He, he, uh, this pastor on the plane that he sat next to he told him there's this girl, I'm going to see she. I really like her, but she's not a Christian. Anyway, this is turning into a whole different podcast. If you want, I will get to the anxiety tips in a second.
Speaker 1:But yeah, he had this book called the Purpose Driven Life by Rick Pastor, rick Warren. He wrote it. It was really popular. This is like 2005. So Kevin's like I think I have a copy of that book and he did it. He already had a copy. He hadn't read it, but anyway, when he came in to see me he didn't tell me any of that.
Speaker 1:Months later, when I was still struggling with his anxiety and I actually ended up sharing it with him, he's like why don't we read it together? And so that was like my first step towards really looking into who Jesus was. I was very much in a place of like, like. I didn't want to be wrong.
Speaker 1:There's so many religions in the world and I don't want to take a side because that's like people will think I'm like, I think they're wrong, and I didn't want anyone to think that I thought they were wrong, because I was like kind of looking into this Jesus thing and I grew up Catholic and it's just a thing when you grow up Catholic to be like very pridefully like I'm Catholic, even though I didn't really believe anything. I still kind of felt loyal to my family's faith I guess. But anyway, I was like I can at least investigate this and it was written, and I guess that book was written kind of, where you investigate your emotions and your, your life, you know, looking at your life and how you're living your life, you know, and to live it purposefully.
Speaker 1:So that was like the very first step I think I guess we're naturally getting into the steps I did to heal right that was the first step was my faith and God said, I think now, looking back, it was like no, you can't have this boy because you're going to do the same things with that boy that you've done with not to make me sound like a floozy Jim but all the other boys, you know, just like dating and partying or whatever. And he was like no hard stop on this one. I mean, kevin was a believer. He had lived a very beautiful, pure life for several years since he became, you know, since he accepted Christ and really gave his life to Christ.
Speaker 1:So I continue that whole year to really struggle with my anxiety and panic attacks. I would say I would get a little better with, like the little self-help books I was doing and then I would fall back into another you know full blown panic attack moment and like had to, like you know, gather myself, pick myself back up off the ground and I really struggled with sleeping. To couple that with these like racing anxious thoughts, you know really feeling panicky about everything. I was very irritable. I like had this loss of appetite. So I lost like 20 pounds, I think. At one point I was free like barely barely above a hundred pounds, and I'm five ones. I was just like really struggling with having an appetite and those were my symptoms and that was a whole year. That was all of 2006, my whole year. And I thought I remember getting to Christmas of 2006 and going Lord I don't, and I had, honestly I'd like a couple times. I felt really good.
Speaker 1:I came up the summer that summer and Kevin and I spent a few weeks together. I was a teacher so I could take off the summer and we had this two weeks that summer where we just had this most wonderful time. Once I was able to, like get in and calm down and visit, and you know, I came up here and stayed here in Atlanta for two weeks and I realized like I really wanted to be with him. But as soon as I went back home I went back in a full on panic attack. What if I don't want to be with him? And what if? What if, what if, what if, what if?
Speaker 1:You know, and when you have this anxious brain and you're not sure you know, your anxiety takes over and you make horrible decisions Like you really can't. It's hard to make decisions when you, when you feel anxious like that and but, um, it was Christmas, it was around Christmas day or the day after Christmas, I heard this radio um advertisement of this woman and she comes on and she says are you anxious and depressed or are you feeling feelings of anxiety? And I was like yes, and do you have lots of headaches and, you know, loss of appetite and your anxieties keeping you from doing what you want. And I'm like yes, yes, and so anyway, sorry, the dog is excited.
Speaker 2:So emotional.
Speaker 1:Hello, oh boy, he might get excited again. And so she had this program and and at the time I was like a single teacher it was expensive, it was like two or three hundred dollars, but I ordered it. It was like anyway, and the tips on this program? You can't even buy it anymore. It's Lucinda Bassett's um, I can't remember the name of the program, lucinda Bassett. You can look her up. She's like retired now living in Malibu and fabulous. But her advice was just riceless, and so what I'm going to go over today is a little bit of that combined with some of the stuff.
Speaker 1:When I went through my that was really my first experience with anxiety and depression was in my early 20s. When I went through it again, I was just so shocked that I it was in my early 30s, right after my third daughter was born I just never thought after I had recovered that first time that I would ever go through anxiety and depression again, because I really like learned to master it, and so it was. So it creeped up so sneakily when I was in my 30s because I thought I had a handle on life. And then things just kind of piled in one by one and it was literally my one of my counselors said it's kind of like a pot of boiling water, like you don't know you're at that boiling point until you're at the boiling point and I just didn't know how to get out of it later in life. So before I go over what I went through, the second, the second season was much longer than my first season with anxiety because I had children and they complicated the issue. You know. To finish up that, first the first story I was telling you that program worked great. It took about three months of just self-help. Actually my workbook is right here. You can see it's so tattered and like old that I've opened it and reviewed some things. Because that's the thing with anxiety, when you have that personality that's prone to it, is you go through certain seasons in life where you're like I need a little support right now and so I would go back to like my notebooks and my old counseling notes and my workbook that I did with that program and I would just go. I see where I've let a few of these strategies kind of go to the wayside and I need to revisit those techniques or strategies for stress relief or for boundaries or whatever it is.
Speaker 1:So fast forward into my early 30s and I had three kids and I was started healing strong with Susie and the gang and the team and I was writing their leadership guide for healing strong and I was writing my blog and I was trying to eat perfect and like home, make everything, and like I just had all this stuff on my like managed social media account oh yeah, and I'm gonna homeschool and I had this baby and a toddler and it was just like remember I would get these emails I mentioned this in the last interview of like people who have cancer and they're pregnant and they have, you know, kids and their homes like themselves, and they want my help and I wanted to help them but yet it was all just piling on me, like you know, and I just I at one point it was one point maybe when my daughter was a little older than a year old there was a couple of things that happened, like the stress.
Speaker 1:I started having physical symptoms that I thought was my cancer coming back, symptoms that I thought was my cancer coming back, and I just imploded. I got a HCG test score I used to do the HCG test you can't even do it anymore and one of my marker. My marker was slightly elevated. It had always for like seven years or eight years at that point then had gone down and then it kind of like went up just a tad and it was enough to push me over and I just had a complete like I don't even know what you want to call it. It wasn't even a panic attack. It was like I'm done with life, I'm going to implode and shut down and like go to it into almost like I don't want to say catatonic state, because I was very aware but I just wanted to go into a dark closet and not come out.
Speaker 1:And that's how I felt closet and not come out, and that's how I felt, and you can't do that when you have three kids and you're homeschooling and you have a blog and you're doing this and you're doing that and you're doing that and that that. But it was just. It's so obvious when I retell the story that I was at a point where I just couldn't handle it all anymore and I therefore went into a very deep depression at that point. And I know there are people listening to this. They know exactly what I'm talking about. I know there are people listening to this. They know exactly what I'm talking about. I know there's people listening to this that have no idea what I'm talking about. But you probably know somebody like that and they need your love and they need you to tell them all good, you're, you're doing great. You know you're doing great. Let's go take a walk outside, because that's one of my strategies.
Speaker 1:By the way, we spend way too much time indoors and every time I would go outside when I was feeling that with my kids or whatever I would, going outside like brings everything down like 40%. You know it's very difficult to feel all the feelings you feel inside when you're outside, but that season of life it's way too long of a story. There's some honestly like moments with like gosh. That's really hard to talk about. So because it it's, those are big, big feelings and big like almost shameful feelings, like how will, how I can't believe, I don't want anyone to know. I felt that way, but I remember the I'll just go ahead and spill the worst, worst part of that whole season was several months, I think, after the initial big moment where I was like I'm done and I kind of just went downhill from there very quickly. It was I just like I just didn't want to be here anymore. I told Kevin, like you got to take me to the hospital and hospitalize me because I'm crazy and you know for a mother not to. I didn't want to be around my children. I would come up and like go upstairs and I would just tell him I can't go back down there, like I can't go back down to the kids because one would be screaming and one would be throwing things in their high chair. The baby was you know whatever, and then the five-year-old was telling me she wanted it and there was just so much like mom shame and mom anxiety and guilt that I just felt like I wasn't enough for my kids and I don't know if I would have felt all that if I weren't like doing all these other things. You know, like I often look back at that Like what if I were just focused on my kids and that was enough? Like being a mom was just enough, it was enough.
Speaker 1:I don't I don't think I would have gone through that season but because, you know, I have my cancer story and felt a lot of, I guess I felt like I was important to the, to these people that were, you know, reading my blog or help, you know, groups that we were getting started with healing strong and like those were all that was. That was also important work. But I think, looking back, I can't regret it. God used it like oh my gosh, how many you know we have so much like healing strong. It's not that it wouldn't have been the same if I wouldn't have done that, but I don't know it would just been different. You know, I just didn't know how to trust God and what he was doing and I felt like I had to get my hands on all of it.
Speaker 1:And it was finally like months later when I, when I, you know, told Susie like I I didn't finish the healing strong leadership guide. It was. I was supposed to write the whole thing and then eventually Susie came on board and, like you know, she took some of it and then we had other group leaders start pouring into it and it ended up being so much better than I ever would have done on my own, you know. So, yeah, so I dropped a couple of tidbits of what I did to heal, but with really, I think it just was getting things off my plate that helped the most. And then prayer, pray, I created a war board. It was a science board, huge science board that you like. You know kids do science projects. I think we saw war room, that movie, the Kendrick's brothers movie and.
Speaker 1:I was like I'm gonna create a war board. So I think I wrote war board at the top. It was my war board, because I didn't have a whole room but it ended up being our guest room and I just but I don't know, whenever we'd have a guest I'd close up the board, and you know, but, uh, yeah, I did that. I moved those post-its around. So that was like my spiritual strategy, like I was serious, god, I want to get better, please and people can apply this to their cancer journeys too like I want to get better. These are things I need prayer around and I just I was so blessed by that, just by that little bit of like obedience, so that's one thing that I did. Because I read so many books. I nothing helped me. I went back through the program that the Lucinda Bassett program I mentioned in my workbook and I just tore. I mean, I went through. I think I went through it twice and every time you go through it it's three months of work went through it twice and every time you go through it's three months of work. You know, um, I was.
Speaker 1:It was so stubborn, this depression I I felt I could not get myself healed and it was just, it wasn't one thing, it was a bunch of little things, prayer and patience, and God dropped red crumbs in my path and I gradually got better over the course of almost four years Wow. So it wasn't this like immediate, I would say. It was kind of like a bell curve. I started off here when our third daughter was born and I had like anxiety postpartum anxiety and then it gradually just like creeped up, as I'm like no, I'm not going to stop that, no, I'm going to keep going with that. And it just got to that breaking point when I got that test score back and it was elevated and then I just went full like really fast, and then that was really the depression part, I would say, and then just kind of stayed at the state of like depression for three years after that. It just was crazy, okay.
Speaker 1:So first thing I think to get out of the feeling that panic, depression, any negative emotion, is to just talk to yourself like a close friend, like oh yeah, there's that feeling again. I feel really anxious right now. One of my counselors told me to say you know, make a joke about it like more I'm, I'm pretty pretty anxious. I'm like more anxious than the average bear, like you know, kind of. Don't let it get to the point where you're thinking the opposite of that. Of course I'd be like I'm anxious, I'm going to have a panic attack, I might have a heart attack. I might have a heart attack right here in this room and die Like whoa. That's like an intense emotion, right. But sometimes and you can even make fun of that, like later on I'm like that's really funny that I would even have thought that I was, I was gonna happen to me, but when you're in that moment you really believe those things right so like a more compassionate talk, like, oh yeah, there's that again.
Speaker 1:Um, a book I read, um, where is it? I have it right here. This is a great book for people. I don't know, it might be backwards, but it's's called the DARE Method. This is fantastic. This is the book.
Speaker 1:I think was like one of the big players in the second season of anxiety in my 30s that I went through. Dare the New Way to End Anxiety and Stop Panic Attacks, stop making it such a big deal. Approach Like don't make your anxiety this big deal. Like you got to really look at it as like oh yeah, there's that anxiety again. I really feel crappy, but let's just keep moving on with our day.
Speaker 1:And one of the techniques he said is imagine, actually draw out. He gives you a couple of little angry little monsters that are your annoying little anxiety friend that sits on your shoulder and is like little you know, whatever you want to call it, whatever language you want to use, a little stinker, um, you know, hanging around with me all day today, gosh, you know. Well, I just wish I could flick him off, but he's. You can't. Anxiety just sticks with you. You can't pay attention and give it credit, or it sticks around. It's like, um, you know those finger traps, those chinese finger, the more you pull, the sucker gets tighter. You just have to release the tension right and then gradually kind of peel it off, because if you pull away it's going to get tighter and worse and more intense, but if you relax it will come right off. So it's the same thing with anxiety. It's like that. That imagery really helped me Okay. So that's the first thing with anxiety. It's like that imagery really helped me, okay. So that's the first thing. So just that gentle talk. And then of course you can kind of along with that, you can slow your breathing.
Speaker 1:Some poses you can do. They're called vagal nerve poses, I think that's what they're called. It's calming the vagus nerve, which is the nerve that runs down racially or the length of your body, I believe. But just try this right now, as you're listening, I'm just crossing my arms and like right across, kind of like touching my I'm crossing my arms across my body and just color boom. It's like corpse pose or something in yoga. It is so calming it will bring in always thinking percentages Like I feel about 20% calmer doing this, or I feel 10% calmer. You're like, ah, I don't have to be stuck in that 100%, I'm going to lose my mind. You know I can. I can bring it down a little bit. It's not perfect. I feel a little anxious still, but it's better. So you can do this.
Speaker 1:Another one. It's like this where you put your like you're saying the pledge, and then you just put your other hand on your belly and that is. You know, I feel about 10% better. I think this is more effective. Sometimes at night, if I can't sleep, I do this and this is so funny. But you know how Al Bundy used to stick his hands down his pants when he came home from work. I had these maternity pants that would go up high and I learned that if I put one hand here and one hand just like on my belly but inside my maternity pants, or even like right next to your hip but inside your your like you know the pants you wear to bed it's really calming. Okay, is that the weirdest thing anyone's ever said on your podcast?
Speaker 2:I think it is yeah.
Speaker 1:All right. So the third thing you can do is you hold your hand, like you're doing like an okay sign, like okay, and then you're going to take your other hand and just kind of squeeze your thumb and your index finger and you can do it. It doesn't matter how you do it, whether you're like this or this, but this one's great when you're in like a public setting and you can't like go like this at the dinner table at a restaurant, but you just are feeling a little bit off, like on, and just hold like that, like that, and then just put it in your lap and it really it's like 15% reduced anxiety or whatever. Like I said, thinking percentages when you, as you're going through this process of healing, it always helped me not to rate my days, because at the beginning I'd have like five bad days where I was like a real mess still, and maybe like one or two days. Usually when I was out of the house I did better, like running errands with Kevin, like the weekends. Weekends were always better because Kevin was home and so, anyway, those are some great tips, especially those beginning when you're just getting started on this process of healing and then, just like I said, getting busy, getting out of the house or whatever it is that you feel, thinking on that percentage scale of like 20 to 30% less anxious, because that, essentially, is going to be what heals your nervous system and gets you to the point where you're like having more. You're having more, better days, more better days. Right, letting time pass, of course, too. So I always notice I felt like a certain percent better when my kids went to bed, because my day was. I could go.
Speaker 1:Huh, just think in thinking maybe if you're keeping like a journal or a calendar when I was healing from, I really started getting a grip on my healing, I would keep a journal, that would. I just cut it into threes and so I would label my mornings. I would do it on like a scale of whatever you want to do, percentage scale, or like one to ten ten being I'm the, however you want to do it, one being I'm the least anxious, ten being I'm the most and you would just say I was like a level 10 today, you know, and you'd write 10 in the morning and then go through your afternoon. What was I in the afternoon? I was like a six. It's a really good afternoon. And then you start realizing oh wow, my mornings are really horrible, but I didn't have such a bad afternoon and an evening.
Speaker 1:And when you divide it that way, you start connecting the patterns of well, what is it in the morning that's stressing me? What in the morning is getting me revved up? Is it this? What systems can I change For me? I used to say, oh, my kids have to have plant based sprouted smoothies or whatever for breakfast, and I would put all this pressure on myself and then they would throw it at the wall or it end up on the floor because they're you know, because they got, you know, cupcakes at blah blah blah birthday party this weekend. And they come on to the smoothies. So I was like, well, maybe I could start adding some honey, or more honey, or sweeten them up, because we live in this world, if we're going to participate.
Speaker 1:Sometimes you got to be flexible and so started to make some changes and maybe that made my morning a little easier, because my kids actually liked their, their breakfast, and it made my heart happy as a mom. So you just have to say am I being too rigid? Is it creating anxiety? Because I'm just being, you know, do? Do I need to change somehow and that helps that little system of rating your lighting morning, afternoon, evening, okay.
Speaker 1:Next thing, one of the things that worked for me the first, my first anxiety season that did not work for me. The second is this it's a very popular strategy with cognitive therapy, where you're learning, where you're learning about how you're thinking. It's a great strategy for me. In my second season I was just entirely too busy. I had kids and it was really difficult for me to even gather and write down everything. You literally, with this strategy, have to write down every negative and positive thought and change a negative to a positive.
Speaker 1:So an example of that would be like I'm always anxious and I'm just never going, I'm never going to get better. That would be your negative thought. More positive, like compassionate thought, would be yeah, you're more anxious than the average bear, that's true, but you know your mornings are really good. In your afternoons you're getting better and you know your evenings. Maybe you could do some work and go outside and take a walk and you could feel the difference and how your body and your is reacting to that.
Speaker 1:And that's important in the emotional healing journey with cancer too, where you just have to stop oh, I'm going to die, I have cancer. Oh my gosh, what are my kids going to? You know, really, really heavy, heavy thoughts, heavy, that don't serve you. So for that one, say that's your negative thought. Positive would be like oh yeah, look, I have cancer. What a wake up call. There are so many things I can do to help myself, starting now. I can't wait to get started. Like. That's so much better than a first thought, right, but that's one other strategy.
Speaker 1:Always pay attention to your shoulds. These are for, like most people who are just like I should do this, or I shouldn't do that, or she should do this, he should do this, he, no, no one should or shouldn't. Like that's just pressure we're putting on ourselves. I'll give you a little thing right now that I am struggling with is that, like I, my parents are wonderful people, but they love being like retired down in Florida and they don't like to drive, they won't fly, so we really rarely see them. So I'm I'm dealing with some emotional stuff around that. Where I'm, you know, I'm just sad, like I'm experiencing sadness, I'm experiencing like regret I imagine I'm going to feel one day. You know they. They're in their 60s and 70s.
Speaker 2:Still young.
Speaker 1:Yeah, they're super young and I keep telling myself they should, they should fly, they should. They shouldn't just stay down there by themselves all the time or whatever. But it's like no, that's their choice. Like it's, I don't like it, I wouldn't do that. But that's like when you're dealing with stuff with other people For yourself, like I should, I should be making something of my life. Well, that's not helpful. A thought more like I'm going to take some gradual steps and set this much time, you know in the afternoon or in the evening, to take steps towards that. That's a much more empowering thought.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:So or I shouldn't, it's, it can be around for me Like I shouldn't eat that. Well, gosh, like I can be so like, like I can just like really whip myself inside my brain, like I can be really, really harsh with myself and some of that's like conviction. You're right, I shouldn't eat fried chicken, like as far as as part of my anti-cancer protocol, but sometimes like that's all that's at a restaurant and I'm nursing or pregnant, I can, I can take the breading off and add it to a salad, you know, or whatever. There are just always different ways to look at situations in life. You know, you don't have to be so rigid. It's learning.
Speaker 1:Part of people with anxiety are very rigid and have strict rules in their head. Um, what my counselor one time? She told me I needed to name the person that's always telling me in my head like you know that part of my brain. It's not a multiple personalities thing, it's like this is like my thoughts, right, but that is really strict with myself. And we named her Clipboard Carol. So when Clipboard Carol comes out and is just like bossing me around, you got to tell her like sit down, sit down, carol, you can name her whatever you want Clipboard Karen right, that's a popular one lately. I'm sorry for all the women named.
Speaker 2:Karen yeah.
Speaker 1:That's really sad. I hate that for them. Okay, another big one Caffeine, alcohol, sugar, all negative, negative, like you shouldn't drink those things in excess and if you have a problem with that, you probably shouldn't drink them at all. I mean, in my 20s, 30, I mean that's the last time I remember really doing that. This was not one of my big problems. I did. I don't drink coffee, so that wasn't a problem, but for some people it is, and it's not that you can't have any coffee. There are things that people do like hey, I'm gonna do half regular, half decaf, or I'm gonna start drinking this weird mushroom coffee.
Speaker 1:I've tried, you like you like it, so some people like it. I liked dandy blend. Have you ever tried dandy blend?
Speaker 1:no, I haven't yeah, dandy, one's kind of like a coffeeish flavor, right. Um, I love green tea and it. Actually there was a season in my life I had to stop and that was such a I I know how the coffee people feel, because that was a hard season for me, like I loved it every morning getting up and, and now I do drink it, but it does give me a buzz. It's still quite it's like half the caffeine of coffee. So you might have to cut some of those things out. Um, physical, uh exertion, like get that. Like when you're healing your nervous system and you're still maybe stuck in that feeling, like I mentioned at the beginning, or you're stuck on the highway or you're stuck in the driveway with your foot on the gas, you know in neutral, like you have to get that energy out. That's that's there. It's there to stay for a little while, but as you're healing you need to get it out. And it might like there are some days I'm like I've got to move my body, I have too much energy and it's going to turn into anxious energy. So you know you got to get it out.
Speaker 1:Essential oils there's some, there's a blend. If you have a doTERRA friend, I'm not a doTERRA rep or anything like that. But my sister used to be, and so if you ever watch my videos on Instagram, people always think I'm a doTERRA person. I'm like nope. My sister was, so she gave me a lot of oils while she did that and I love essential oils, but they are not this like cure, all you know. It's not going to cure your anxiety, but it can be a tool. So there's a blend that doTERRA has called Serenity, which, if you struggle with sleep, I wish I would have had this when I was struggling with sleep. I didn't actually find it until afterwards, but it is such a great. You just put like two or three drops on your pillow and I go to sleep. Every time when I can't sleep, it's like 100% success rate. So I probably sold some oils for somebody out there just now.
Speaker 1:Well, let's see. Yeah, just I was saying pay attention to when you are outside, how you feel, because in pay attention for those days that you're outside and you're keeping track on your calendar of your morning, afternoon and night. Who has 11 kids now I think she's homeschooled and I would call her sometimes and be like how do you do this? Like what do you do? And she would say I go outside on my deck, I eat a cookie and I go back and do the Lord's work for my family. So that's great advice and I've taken it a few times. I mean not with a cookie, but um, something I enjoy, a popsicle or you know something that is tastes good and broccoli or for me, I love to go out in my garden.
Speaker 1:if you're on instagram, um, at anti-cancer mom is my handle there and I do a ton of gardening videos and things and I love it. I love growing my food that we eat and that I'm juicing Saves money too, okay. And then I would just say the what ifs are a huge issue for people with cancer. Right, what if this, what if that? You just can't even begin to entertain it, because if you are entertaining any negative thoughts about that, you're ultimately playing God, but you're not. You're like kind of playing Satan, right?
Speaker 1:You're like you're being like you're on his side. What if I do this? You know well there's always a chance. We are not in control, but it's not helping us to believe that way. So you just got to move forward. We know you know what we do in this life is. You know you don't know how it's impacting people and every bit of just getting up in the morning and doing what God gave you to do is important work and you're a part of his plan in that and just stay focused on the present. You know, chris Carr is a 20 something plus year cancer survivor and her cancer never went away. She's lived with it. So just like, if you're especially if you're dealing with the cancer stuff, stop focusing on. You need to get this out of my body.
Speaker 1:I remember that thought very well I had. That was one of the first things I said to my husband. I just want it out of me and you just can't. What if? Because you don't know what if? What if every day you get a little bit better? And what if you learn to love juicing and you inspire other people? You know, and you raise children and grandchildren who are also recognize the benefits of the nutrition and the and what you put in your body and what you think and you teach all these things. You're learning and you teach them what you, you pass down wisdom or you share wisdom with friends. Like what if that? Let's like, stop focusing so much on this horrible outcome. That may or may not happen, but if you, you know, focus on the positive. You know we don't know where it's going, but so much more positive you don't get. You don't get, you know, tackled with the negative thinking and therefore don't do the other great things you could do in your life. And so, in general, that's all that's it.
Speaker 2:I'm so anxious and I'm grateful.
Speaker 1:I wrote it down. I would say, if you're, if someone's listening and they're experiencing like health anxiety or they're worried because they're listening to this, they have anxiety or depression or cancer or whatever. Like I am 100 percent, yes, do this, do this one thing, and that is go get a physical Talk to a trusted doctor, get the blood work. You need to feel at peace, or if, even if it's a scan, you need to get at peace. Do that and then accept those answers and move on with your life, because there are so many people that email me that are crippled what if I have cancer? What if this is cancer? Or you know I do have cancer, or whatever it is. And I'm like you need to get all the information and take it and move forward with your plan, because people are, they're paralyzed with fear. So get the information and then move on with your life and make a positive change plan. That's the best thing you can do. Wow, that's it.
Speaker 2:That's great. I mean, as a person who doesn't really deal with anxiety and depression. I get that from my dad. He was a World War II vet. Very calm, one speed.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:I'm like a chihuahua compared to him, but he never stressed over anything. He lived till he was 96. Yeah, I think I told you before I have a son who is very much affected by his surroundings, in which I never understood that he had a lot of anxieties and he still does. He's getting older. Now he's starting to deal with them better. He's a very good kid. Had me worried there for a while but I didn't notice and I didn't know what to do because I don't, you know, I've never been through that kind of stuff, but I did notice.
Speaker 2:when we go for a walk he calms down and then he just starts talking about issues he's and he doesn't like to talk much like well when we're driving the car, he already ever talks, but then when we're out in nature, he'll just start talking about issues he's dealing with and he figures out the answers while he's talking. Yes, maybe if I just do more of this and not that I should be Maybe if I stop being a jerk. He even said that one time.
Speaker 3:I said yeah, I don't even have to raise this kid.
Speaker 2:He's doing it on his own and then he would listen to scriptures as he's going to sleep, or these videos that are constantly talking about what. God thinks about you, as opposed to what social media, which he's not on social media. So that's one good thing. He'd be a whole different person if he's on social media listening to people, but because he's only 16.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, he's in a vulnerable age, for sure.
Speaker 2:Yes, yes, but yeah. So yeah so, yeah, I mean that all makes sense to me from someone who doesn't understand it, but I've seen how he reacts to it.
Speaker 1:So you're doing the best thing, jim, just by being there to listen, because a lot of this stuff I mentioned the last podcast about how kevin was my lie, samurai- by the way, did I? Did I even wrap up the the boy? I told you the boy was your husband, which is crazy.
Speaker 1:Once I got over my anxiety, I moved to Atlanta like three months after that and God just dropped a job at the best school in Atlanta in my lap. It was crazy how he cared for me during that time. There's so many miracles. As a new believer I was, you know, I got baptized in the ocean. I think I mentioned that in our last podcast too. Wow, six months later we got engaged and six months later we got married and then, three months after that, I got cancer and like the whole story is all pieced together Right.
Speaker 1:And here I am now on this podcast sharing the whole story. It's the first time I've ever done that, but going back to your son, you being the lie samurai for your son could be something that you know. You with your more stable presence and personality and wisdom right, you can you can speak into that for him. That's one really nice, really wonderful.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I wish it was just because I'm more spiritual, but it's just my personality type, so well that no.
Speaker 1:Combined it, all you know mixes together into the perfect father for him.
Speaker 2:Okay, we'll go with that, we'll go with that All for him. Okay, we'll go with that. We'll go with that, all right? Well, hey, is there anything else you want to share with people, or I don't want you to be anxious once we hang up here.
Speaker 1:No, I feel much better. People don't know. I almost bailed on the last podcast because I shared so much. It was like burying my soul and I struggled with anxiety a little bit not like you know, acute anxiety for a little bit and I told Jim I think we need to scrap it and redo it. And so we scheduled this interview and I think it was really in when I was in prayer, like oh God say, like no, you need to say tell people what you did, cause I really didn't get into that. So it's just that's what I did. That's the whole shebang. I hope I helped a lot of people, cause I remember feeling when I was going through these like there's no hope, you know. So hopefully it's really helpful for someone listening.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah.
Speaker 1:I think. I don't know, it'll probably be in the show notes, but yeah, I have a blog, anticancermomcom, and then anticancermom on both Facebook and Instagram. I'm pretty active, probably too much, but I really enjoy it. As long as I'm enjoying it and it doesn't cause me anxiety, I will stay on social media. The minute it isn't, you know, impeding my life, I will get off. But for now it's a healthy amount of use.
Speaker 2:Yes, well, courtney, you're a very entertaining person.
Speaker 1:Thanks, the dog and pony show here. No. Thank you, jim.
Speaker 2:Sure or.
Speaker 1:John or Jim Inside joke.
Speaker 2:Yes, well, thank you so much, and maybe we'll do a part three here sometime.
Speaker 1:I don't know, we'll see.
Speaker 2:Maybe later people request it. We'll see you later.
Speaker 3:Bye. You've been listening to the I Am Healing Strong podcast, a part of the Healing Strong organization. We hope you found encouragement in this episode, as well as the confidence to take control of your healing journey, knowing that God will guide you on this path. Healing Strong is a nonprofit organization whose mission is to connect, support and educate individuals facing cancer and other diseases through strategies that help to rebuild the body, renew the soul and refresh the spirit.
Speaker 3:It costs nothing to be a part of a local or online group. You can do that by going to our website at healingstrongorg and finding a group near you or an online group, or start your own, your choice. While you're there, take a look around at all the free resources. Though the resources and groups are free, we encourage you to join our membership program at $25 or $75 a month. This helps us to be able to reach more people with hope and encouragement, and that also comes with some extra perks as well. So check it out. If you enjoyed this podcast, please give us a five-star rating, leave an encouraging comment and help us spread the word. We'll see you next week with another story on the I Am Healing Strong podcast.
